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Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  zerowing21 on Thu Dec 29, 2016 3:58 pm

Then he wouldn't be a great manipulator in that case either. Manipulators use lying as part of their trade. Even the mos subtle of mind games, as to start with some small lie to spark it off. If he hates to lie, then he can't do the job very well or at all.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  youngjusticeforever on Thu Dec 29, 2016 4:00 pm

Again, you are taking "hates to" as synonymous to "won't do"

Which is totally wrong.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  zerowing21 on Thu Dec 29, 2016 4:12 pm

Even if doesn't like to, that still flies in the face of what manipulators do. Some even enjoy the feeling of lying.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  youngjusticeforever on Thu Dec 29, 2016 4:14 pm

Why are we discussing this? I've said it before, I'll say it again. He prefers not to lie. He can still manipulate very well.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  zerowing21 on Thu Dec 29, 2016 4:23 pm

Can you please not lash out like you are? It's not very believable to have someone who is able to manipulate others to dislike lying. That's like one of the core aspects of it.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  youngjusticeforever on Thu Dec 29, 2016 4:28 pm

I'm not lashing out..? I'm getting mildly frustrated, though.

His mentality process goes "If you must lie to get someone to believe you, then you are not very good at manipulation." He's like one of the fairie's from the Shadowhunter Chronicles, but he can lie. But he'll usually just distort the truth to convince others.

I don't see why he can't be a manipulator without having to incessantly lie. He will lie when it is required.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  zerowing21 on Thu Dec 29, 2016 4:53 pm

To me, its a bit of lashing out.

His thought process is contrary to what every manipulator does. I've never seen shadowhunt, so that's something I wouldn't get. If you want him this way, then expect that he's not going to be as convincing to others as one would expect.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  youngjusticeforever on Fri Dec 30, 2016 3:19 am

I'm sorry you feel that way.

The Seelie Queen can manipulate people without lying. They don't lie, as they literally cannot, but instead will just distort the truth or give half-truths. Zeytran would probably do something similar, except he CAN lie, he just refrains from doing it until necessary.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  zerowing21 on Fri Dec 30, 2016 9:25 pm

I would call what that character did in those books word play to lead to confusion, not exactly the same kind of manipulation you're dealing with for this. But make it clear on what kind of manipulation he uses so no one is confused.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  youngjusticeforever on Sat Dec 31, 2016 5:31 am

He doesn't use just one. He'll use whatever manipulation he needs to, but I think the word play, like the Seelie Queen, would probably be his favorite and most exercised.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  zerowing21 on Sun Jan 01, 2017 1:28 pm

You didn't update the weakness I told you to update.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  youngjusticeforever on Sun Jan 01, 2017 4:50 pm

You didn't tell me any weakness to update.

He doesn't use one specific brand of manipulation, so I can't update it with that.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  zerowing21 on Sun Jan 01, 2017 6:28 pm

I did if you look back at the last page. I told you to explain a certain one and you didn't do that.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  youngjusticeforever on Sun Jan 01, 2017 7:52 pm

I still do not follow. It would be easier if you'd just say it again instead of doing this.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  zerowing21 on Sun Jan 01, 2017 8:08 pm

I said to explain it, you explained it to me and I said to put it in.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  youngjusticeforever on Sun Jan 01, 2017 10:19 pm

Done. Next time could you be more forward with how you phrase it? It's kind of annoying and pointless. I could've gotten this done sooner if you had just said it.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  zerowing21 on Sun Jan 01, 2017 10:47 pm

Now, to the history fixes that shadow recommended to you.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  youngjusticeforever on Mon Jan 02, 2017 2:19 pm

A. He never really gave me solutions, he just pointed out "errors"
B. "Errors" being things that were okay last time, but not now.

The ones I could fix I already did.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  Blueyedemoness on Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:35 pm

youngjusticeforever wrote:A. He never really gave me solutions, he just pointed out "errors"
  B. "Errors" being things that were okay last time, but not now.

The ones I could fix I already did.

A. He doesn't have to provide you with solutions for your errors. The most he can do is give you suggestions, but ultimately you are the one who has to find solutions that would fix the problems with your characters.

B. The errors he is pointing out are new ones that concern his history concerning Demongo. As Shadow pointed out, Demo does not live in the Underworld and wouldn't be caught just strolling in the realm just for the hell of it. He also wouldn't take pity on someone being bullied. Why would he even see potential in someone being bullied? Those who are are often weak and can't defend themselves. So for Demongo; who looks for strong souls for his collection, he wouldn't even look Zeytran's way even if he was walking around the Underworld.

In all honestly the most problems in this history are how you portray Demongo himself, which contradicts the one in the rp. He may act silly and a bit comic relief cause of the way Kyra (who rps him for the most part) portrays him, but he acts this way cause of his love for Ely. So there is no reason he'd act even remotely like he does as you explain in the history when he hadn't met her at that point in time. My suggestion is to put Demongo out of most of his history. Maybe Zeytran only meets him after the massacre he causes and more mastery over his ice powers. That way it would make more sense for the demon to find him interesting.

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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  youngjusticeforever on Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:38 pm

A. He doesn't give good suggestions then.

B. No. Back when I first did Zeytran, it was actually, if I recall correctly, YOU who suggested the bullying thing, seeing how Demongo was a "wimp" before the show. It has nothing to do with how I portrayed him and I'm getting fed up with you all implying/insinuating that I am lying.

Besides, why would Demongo just be strolling around the upper world? It makes way more sense for him to have been hunting for souls and come across Zeytran.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  zerowing21 on Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:48 pm

Because he takes souls of the living warriors and that is where his master is. His master sends him places in the world above to take out threats to him. The underworld is no interest to Aku. Have you ever seen the one shot episode with him in it.
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  youngjusticeforever on Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:51 pm

Um, yes, I have seen it.

You know, maybe give some better suggestions. Cause if I went with what Blue said, here's what would happen next:

"Why would Demongo take interest in him?"
"Why would Demongo come across him?"

This history worked before, why can't it work now? You guys are so inconsistent >.<
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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  zerowing21 on Mon Jan 02, 2017 4:06 pm

The history ties too heavily with Demongo, it's pretty much dominated by it. There is less about his history with his family than anything. Just the basic facts in this, Demongo wouldn't be in the under world at all, thus he and Zeytran wouldn't meet til years and years later. Use the bullying thing to force Zeytran to become stronger and to develop the skills he has.

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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  Blueyedemoness on Mon Jan 02, 2017 4:14 pm

That is rather rude of you, young. Shadow is only doing his best to help you get your character accepted just like the rest of us. You don't have to take his suggestions but at the very least think about them and use them to adapt your character accordingly.

I do not recall actually telling you to include the bullying concept (though that could just be its been so long I forgot). Though I do see that I told you that you should make it clear that Demo saw potential to manipulate him. Regardless, now that I've looked over this character once more I realize that my thoughts on that have changed. It was a mistake for my past self not to point out the inconsistent personality of what you perceive Demongo as and who he is in the rp.

And it has everything to do with how you portrayed him. The Demongo in our rp wouldn't have done the things you explain in your history for Zeytran; even before he met Ely. We are not trying to insinuate or imply that you are lying; you are just misunderstanding or ignoring our suggestions because it's not going the way you want it to.

As Zero said, Demo is on the surface because he's destroying Aku's enemies and gathering more souls from living warriors. There are no threats in the Underworld towards Aku other than Javerick and Demo wouldn't be able to do anything against him.

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Re: Zeytran, the Teen-Demon

Post  youngjusticeforever on Mon Jan 02, 2017 4:30 pm

I admit it may be rude, but I am getting very frustrated. His suggestions aren't helping me, though.

I can bring up the thread, if you want.

That is not what ya'll said last time. I've accommodated the profile accordingly, but I don't exactly have a good, detailed personality for Demongo I can call upon. I don't mind it not going the way I want, but I do mind when nobody can even look at it from my point.

I'm imagining a little spoof of Aku saying "go kill Javerick" and Demongo acting like a kitten and whimpering, then he tries to assassinate Javerick but he runs away before he even starts.

XD

Wait, isn't Him sometimes in the Underworld?
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